| Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169794] |
Mon, 27 September 2010 02:06  |
Graham Hobbs
Messages: 42
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Member |
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Hello,
Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
document, so ..
1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
2. client accesses the one page website
3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
client machine) then submits
4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
(calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
php1
5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
Form data but with additions and changes
6. client views the Form data
7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
So is my concept:
- feasible?
- reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
Please, thanks in advance
Graham
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169802 is a reply to message #169794] |
Mon, 27 September 2010 11:39  |
Jerry Stuckle
Messages: 2598
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
> document, so ..
>
> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
> 2. client accesses the one page website
> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
> client machine) then submits
> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
> php1
> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
> Form data but with additions and changes
> 6. client views the Form data
> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>
> So is my concept:
> - feasible?
> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>
> Please, thanks in advance
> Graham
It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex(at)attglobal(dot)net
==================
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169807 is a reply to message #169794] |
Mon, 27 September 2010 13:03 |
Captain Paralytic
Messages: 204
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 27 Sep, 03:06, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
> document, so ..
>
> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
> 2. client accesses the one page website
> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
> client machine) then submits
> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
> php1
> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
> Form data but with additions and changes
> 6. client views the Form data
> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>
> So is my concept:
> - feasible?
> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>
> Please, thanks in advance
> Graham
I'm not sure what you mean by: "to be javascript edited at client
machine", but in general you are describing a pretty standard
approach, until you reach the part that says:
"passing it to a Windows cmd file (calling dozens of pgms) for further
processing and returning data to php1"
It is more normal to perform one's processing in the programming
language of the file that receives the form data. Running "dozens of
[Windoze] programs", sounds like it could be a time consuming task,
fraught with the possibilities that one of them has an error that you
somehow have to handle and return to the user. It is occasionally
necessary to execute a shell program, but most people try to avoid it.
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169814 is a reply to message #169807] |
Mon, 27 September 2010 14:49 |
sheldonlg
Messages: 166
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 9/27/2010 9:03 AM, Captain Paralytic wrote:
> On 27 Sep, 03:06, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>> document, so ..
>>
>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>> client machine) then submits
>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>> php1
>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>> Form data but with additions and changes
>> 6. client views the Form data
>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>
>> So is my concept:
>> - feasible?
>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>
>> Please, thanks in advance
>> Graham
>
> I'm not sure what you mean by: "to be javascript edited at client
> machine", but in general you are describing a pretty standard
> approach, until you reach the part that says:
> "passing it to a Windows cmd file (calling dozens of pgms) for further
> processing and returning data to php1"
>
> It is more normal to perform one's processing in the programming
> language of the file that receives the form data. Running "dozens of
> [Windoze] programs", sounds like it could be a time consuming task,
> fraught with the possibilities that one of them has an error that you
> somehow have to handle and return to the user. It is occasionally
> necessary to execute a shell program, but most people try to avoid it.
Furthermore you have the question of synchronicity. You have to wait to
get the response back from all of these external processes before
returning to the caller's page. That means you need a way to know when
the external process has completed. In general (with exceptions), it is
a bad idea.
--
Shelly
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169817 is a reply to message #169814] |
Mon, 27 September 2010 15:22 |
Captain Paralytic
Messages: 204
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 27 Sep, 15:49, sheldonlg <sheldonlg> wrote:
> On 9/27/2010 9:03 AM, Captain Paralytic wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>> On 27 Sep, 03:06, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>> Hello,
>
>>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>> document, so ..
>
>>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>> client machine) then submits
>>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>> php1
>>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>> Form data but with additions and changes
>>> 6. client views the Form data
>>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>
>>> So is my concept:
>>> - feasible?
>>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>
>>> Please, thanks in advance
>>> Graham
>
>> I'm not sure what you mean by: "to be javascript edited at client
>> machine", but in general you are describing a pretty standard
>> approach, until you reach the part that says:
>> "passing it to a Windows cmd file (calling dozens of pgms) for further
>> processing and returning data to php1"
>
>> It is more normal to perform one's processing in the programming
>> language of the file that receives the form data. Running "dozens of
>> [Windoze] programs", sounds like it could be a time consuming task,
>> fraught with the possibilities that one of them has an error that you
>> somehow have to handle and return to the user. It is occasionally
>> necessary to execute a shell program, but most people try to avoid it.
>
> Furthermore you have the question of synchronicity. You have to wait to
> get the response back from all of these external processes before
> returning to the caller's page. That means you need a way to know when
> the external process has completed. In general (with exceptions), it is
> a bad idea.
Doesn't that simply depend on how it is executed. Since this is a cmd
file, it suggests that the external programs will be called
sequentially, so all that is needed it to wait for the cmd file to
exit. Not that this makes the idea any better mind you!
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169819 is a reply to message #169817] |
Mon, 27 September 2010 15:49 |
sheldonlg
Messages: 166
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 9/27/2010 11:22 AM, Captain Paralytic wrote:
> On 27 Sep, 15:49, sheldonlg<sheldonlg> wrote:
>> On 9/27/2010 9:03 AM, Captain Paralytic wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 27 Sep, 03:06, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> Hello,
>>
>>>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> document, so ..
>>
>>>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> client machine) then submits
>>>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> php1
>>>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>
>>>> So is my concept:
>>>> - feasible?
>>>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>
>>>> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> Graham
>>
>>> I'm not sure what you mean by: "to be javascript edited at client
>>> machine", but in general you are describing a pretty standard
>>> approach, until you reach the part that says:
>>> "passing it to a Windows cmd file (calling dozens of pgms) for further
>>> processing and returning data to php1"
>>
>>> It is more normal to perform one's processing in the programming
>>> language of the file that receives the form data. Running "dozens of
>>> [Windoze] programs", sounds like it could be a time consuming task,
>>> fraught with the possibilities that one of them has an error that you
>>> somehow have to handle and return to the user. It is occasionally
>>> necessary to execute a shell program, but most people try to avoid it.
>>
>> Furthermore you have the question of synchronicity. You have to wait to
>> get the response back from all of these external processes before
>> returning to the caller's page. That means you need a way to know when
>> the external process has completed. In general (with exceptions), it is
>> a bad idea.
> Doesn't that simply depend on how it is executed. Since this is a cmd
Absolutely.
> file, it suggests that the external programs will be called
> sequentially, so all that is needed it to wait for the cmd file to
Not necessarily. What, for example, if the command file being executed
has asynchronous actions? Then, even if you wait for each command to
return, you cannot be sure that everything underneath is completed.
> exit. Not that this makes the idea any better mind you!
Exactly.
--
Shelly
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169875 is a reply to message #169802] |
Wed, 29 September 2010 03:16 |
Graham Hobbs
Messages: 42
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Member |
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On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
<jstucklex(at)attglobal(dot)net> wrote:
> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>> document, so ..
>>
>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>> client machine) then submits
>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>> php1
>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>> Form data but with additions and changes
>> 6. client views the Form data
>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>
>> So is my concept:
>> - feasible?
>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>
>> Please, thanks in advance
>> Graham
>
> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
---
Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
to go:-(.
not very practical - Jerry
it is a bad idea - Shelly
not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
fields (Forms?) for:
Student Number
First Name
Surname
Faculty
Major
So ..
1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
goto 1.
Is this a practical web application?
Thanks again
Graham
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169876 is a reply to message #169875] |
Wed, 29 September 2010 04:41 |
Denis McMahon
Messages: 634
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 29/09/10 04:16, Graham Hobbs wrote:
> Student Number
> First Name
> Surname
> Faculty
> Major
>
> So ..
> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
> goto 1.
>
> Is this a practical web application?
Can I (or anyone else) enter random student numbers and use this to
obtain information about random students?
Is there a data security implication, or even a student personal safety
implication, if anyone viewing the website can obtain data about
students simply by stumbling across the right "identifier"?
I'd suggest:
1. Student logs in with student number and a password
2. Student sees only their own data
Rgds
Denis McMahon
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169881 is a reply to message #169876] |
Wed, 29 September 2010 10:17 |
Geoff Berrow
Messages: 16
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Junior Member |
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On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 05:41:09 +0100, Denis McMahon
<denis(dot)m(dot)f(dot)mcmahon(at)googlemail(dot)com> wrote:
> On 29/09/10 04:16, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>
>> Student Number
>> First Name
>> Surname
>> Faculty
>> Major
>>
>> So ..
>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>> goto 1.
>>
>> Is this a practical web application?
>
> Can I (or anyone else) enter random student numbers and use this to
> obtain information about random students?
>
> Is there a data security implication, or even a student personal safety
> implication, if anyone viewing the website can obtain data about
> students simply by stumbling across the right "identifier"?
>
> I'd suggest:
>
> 1. Student logs in with student number and a password
> 2. Student sees only their own data
If it's an administrative function a simple search on all or part of
the users surname would perhaps be more practical (provided the page
is protected by some form of administrative log in)
--
Geoff Berrow (Put thecat out to email)
It's only Usenet, no one dies.
My opinions, not the committee's, mine.
Simple RFDs www.4theweb.co.uk/rfdmaker
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169895 is a reply to message #169875] |
Wed, 29 September 2010 14:17 |
Captain Paralytic
Messages: 204
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>
>
>
>
>
> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>> Hello,
>
>>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>> document, so ..
>
>>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>> client machine) then submits
>>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>> php1
>>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>> Form data but with additions and changes
>>> 6. client views the Form data
>>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>
>>> So is my concept:
>>> - feasible?
>>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>
>>> Please, thanks in advance
>>> Graham
>
>> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>
> ---
> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
> to go:-(.
> not very practical - Jerry
> it is a bad idea - Shelly
> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>
> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
> fields (Forms?) for:
>
> Student Number
> First Name
> Surname
> Faculty
> Major
>
> So ..
> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
> goto 1.
>
> Is this a practical web application?
>
> Thanks again
> Graham
So you are suggesting:
1) User submits a request.
2) Server supplies a response.
This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
this is a practical web application.
I'm sure you can work out that it is.
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169896 is a reply to message #169895] |
Wed, 29 September 2010 15:42 |
Graham Hobbs
Messages: 42
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Member |
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On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
<paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> Hello,
>>
>>>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> document, so ..
>>
>>>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> client machine) then submits
>>>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> php1
>>>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>
>>>> So is my concept:
>>>> - feasible?
>>>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>
>>>> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> Graham
>>
>>> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>
>> ---
>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>> to go:-(.
>> not very practical - Jerry
>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>
>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>> fields (Forms?) for:
>>
>> Student Number
>> First Name
>> Surname
>> Faculty
>> Major
>>
>> So ..
>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>> goto 1.
>>
>> Is this a practical web application?
>>
>> Thanks again
>> Graham
>
> So you are suggesting:
> 1) User submits a request.
> 2) Server supplies a response.
>
> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
> this is a practical web application.
>
> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
---
Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
(or user logs off).
Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
project.
OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169899 is a reply to message #169896] |
Wed, 29 September 2010 16:24 |
Jerry Stuckle
Messages: 2598
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 9/29/2010 11:42 AM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>
>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> > Hello,
>>>
>>>> > Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> > coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> > am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> > document, so ..
>>>
>>>> > 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> > 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> > 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> > client machine) then submits
>>>> > 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> > (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> > php1
>>>> > 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> > Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> > 6. client views the Form data
>>>> > 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>
>>>> > So is my concept:
>>>> > - feasible?
>>>> > - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>
>>>> > Please, thanks in advance
>>>> > Graham
>>>
>>>> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>> to go:-(.
>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>
>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>>>
>>> Student Number
>>> First Name
>>> Surname
>>> Faculty
>>> Major
>>>
>>> So ..
>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>> goto 1.
>>>
>>> Is this a practical web application?
>>>
>>> Thanks again
>>> Graham
>>
>> So you are suggesting:
>> 1) User submits a request.
>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>
>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>> this is a practical web application.
>>
>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
> ---
> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>
> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
> (or user logs off).
>
> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
> project.
>
> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
Yes, in this way, web pages are very similar to CICS transactions. But
there are differences, and don't try to make one fit the other.
--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex(at)attglobal(dot)net
==================
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169902 is a reply to message #169896] |
Wed, 29 September 2010 17:25 |
sheldonlg
Messages: 166
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 9/29/2010 11:42 AM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>
>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> > Hello,
>>>
>>>> > Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> > coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> > am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> > document, so ..
>>>
>>>> > 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> > 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> > 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> > client machine) then submits
>>>> > 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> > (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> > php1
>>>> > 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> > Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> > 6. client views the Form data
>>>> > 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>
>>>> > So is my concept:
>>>> > - feasible?
>>>> > - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>
>>>> > Please, thanks in advance
>>>> > Graham
>>>
>>>> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>> to go:-(.
>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>
>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>>>
>>> Student Number
>>> First Name
>>> Surname
>>> Faculty
>>> Major
>>>
>>> So ..
>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>> goto 1.
>>>
>>> Is this a practical web application?
>>>
>>> Thanks again
>>> Graham
>>
>> So you are suggesting:
>> 1) User submits a request.
>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>
>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>> this is a practical web application.
>>
>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
> ---
> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>
> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
> (or user logs off).
>
> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
> project.
>
> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
I'd suggest this:
For a student:
1- Have the user log in. A successful login would bring back the
student id which you would set in a session variable.
2 - Have a link to a page to present the user information. It would
first query the database with that value for the student and then
present him with his information via html.
For faculty:
1 - The faculty member logs in and a session variable is set that
indicates he is faculty.
2 - Have a link to a page for student information. On that page what
appears at first is a drop-down list with all the student names and
empty values for all the properties. The value of each <option> would
be the students id in the student table. There would be an onchange to
invoke an AJAX call using that value of the option..
3 - The AJAX would get the information from the database and on return
it would display all the properties of the student in the proper fields.
Alternatively for the faculty, if you don't want AJAX or javascript, you
could just have have all that but no onchange. Instead, have a button
that submits it and have the submission use the value from the list to
find all the data from the database and then repaint the entire screen
using all those values as initial values.
This is rather easy stuff and you will need to get familiar with these
because they are done _all_ the time.
BTW, what I said was a bad idea was using shell functions where not
essential.
--
Shelly
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169921 is a reply to message #169896] |
Thu, 30 September 2010 09:32 |
Captain Paralytic
Messages: 204
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 29 Sep, 16:42, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>
>
>
>
>
> <paul_laut...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>
>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> > Hello,
>
>>>> > Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> > coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> > am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> > document, so ..
>
>>>> > 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> > 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> > 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> > client machine) then submits
>>>> > 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> > (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> > php1
>>>> > 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> > Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> > 6. client views the Form data
>>>> > 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>
>>>> > So is my concept:
>>>> > - feasible?
>>>> > - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>
>>>> > Please, thanks in advance
>>>> > Graham
>
>>>> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>
>>> ---
>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>> to go:-(.
>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>
>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>
>>> Student Number
>>> First Name
>>> Surname
>>> Faculty
>>> Major
>
>>> So ..
>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>> goto 1.
>
>>> Is this a practical web application?
>
>>> Thanks again
>>> Graham
>
>> So you are suggesting:
>> 1) User submits a request.
>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>
>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>> this is a practical web application.
>
>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>
> ---
> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>
> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
> (or user logs off).
>
> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
> project.
>
> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
I too am a CICS programmer and my statement still stands. This is how
pretty much all CRUD applications work.
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169935 is a reply to message #169896] |
Thu, 30 September 2010 15:52 |
Graham Hobbs
Messages: 42
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Member |
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On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs <ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>
>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> > Hello,
>>>
>>>> > Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> > coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> > am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> > document, so ..
>>>
>>>> > 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> > 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> > 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> > client machine) then submits
>>>> > 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> > (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> > php1
>>>> > 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> > Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> > 6. client views the Form data
>>>> > 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>
>>>> > So is my concept:
>>>> > - feasible?
>>>> > - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>
>>>> > Please, thanks in advance
>>>> > Graham
>>>
>>>> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>> to go:-(.
>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>
>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>>>
>>> Student Number
>>> First Name
>>> Surname
>>> Faculty
>>> Major
>>>
>>> So ..
>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>> goto 1.
>>>
>>> Is this a practical web application?
>>>
>>> Thanks again
>>> Graham
>>
>> So you are suggesting:
>> 1) User submits a request.
>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>
>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>> this is a practical web application.
>>
>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
> ---
> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>
> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
> (or user logs off).
>
> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
> project.
>
> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
---
CP, Jerry, Shelly,
CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
Graham
P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
'calls' so a side question if I may:
Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
from php and something like this is possible:
- block A of some php code
- 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
- block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
code.
This would work?
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169936 is a reply to message #169935] |
Thu, 30 September 2010 15:56 |
sheldonlg
Messages: 166
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 9/30/2010 11:52 AM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs<ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> > On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> >> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >> document, so ..
>>>>
>>>> >> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >> client machine) then submits
>>>> >> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >> php1
>>>> >> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>>
>>>> >> So is my concept:
>>>> >> - feasible?
>>>> >> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>>
>>>> >> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >> Graham
>>>>
>>>> > It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>>
>>>> ---
>>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> to go:-(.
>>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>>
>>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>>>>
>>>> Student Number
>>>> First Name
>>>> Surname
>>>> Faculty
>>>> Major
>>>>
>>>> So ..
>>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> goto 1.
>>>>
>>>> Is this a practical web application?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks again
>>>> Graham
>>>
>>> So you are suggesting:
>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>>
>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>> this is a practical web application.
>>>
>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>> ---
>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>>
>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>> (or user logs off).
>>
>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>> project.
>>
>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
> ---
> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
> Graham
>
> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>
> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
> from php and something like this is possible:
>
> - block A of some php code
> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>
> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
> code.
> This would work?
exec or system. Those work on Unix. I have never used php of windows
servers, but I imagine they would work the same way.
Like I said, though, "not a good idea".
--
Shelly
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169937 is a reply to message #169935] |
Thu, 30 September 2010 15:56 |
sheldonlg
Messages: 166
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
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On 9/30/2010 11:52 AM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs<ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> > On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> >> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >> document, so ..
>>>>
>>>> >> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >> client machine) then submits
>>>> >> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >> php1
>>>> >> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>>
>>>> >> So is my concept:
>>>> >> - feasible?
>>>> >> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>>
>>>> >> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >> Graham
>>>>
>>>> > It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>>
>>>> ---
>>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> to go:-(.
>>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>>
>>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>>>>
>>>> Student Number
>>>> First Name
>>>> Surname
>>>> Faculty
>>>> Major
>>>>
>>>> So ..
>>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> goto 1.
>>>>
>>>> Is this a practical web application?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks again
>>>> Graham
>>>
>>> So you are suggesting:
>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>>
>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>> this is a practical web application.
>>>
>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>> ---
>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>>
>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>> (or user logs off).
>>
>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>> project.
>>
>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
> ---
> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
> Graham
>
> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>
> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
> from php and something like this is possible:
>
> - block A of some php code
> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>
> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
> code.
> This would work?
One more thing:
Look at www.php.net. It is what I call "The Bible".
--
Shelly
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169938 is a reply to message #169935] |
Thu, 30 September 2010 16:00 |
Captain Paralytic
Messages: 204
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
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On 30 Sep, 16:52, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>> <paul_laut...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>
>>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> >On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >> Hello,
>
>>>> >> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >> document, so ..
>
>>>> >> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >> client machine) then submits
>>>> >> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >> php1
>>>> >> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>
>>>> >> So is my concept:
>>>> >> - feasible?
>>>> >> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>
>>>> >> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >> Graham
>
>>>> >It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>
>>>> ---
>>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> to go:-(.
>>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>
>>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>
>>>> Student Number
>>>> First Name
>>>> Surname
>>>> Faculty
>>>> Major
>
>>>> So ..
>>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> goto 1.
>
>>>> Is this a practical web application?
>
>>>> Thanks again
>>>> Graham
>
>>> So you are suggesting:
>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>
>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>> this is a practical web application.
>
>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>> ---
>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>
>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>> (or user logs off).
>
>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>> project.
>
>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
>
> ---
> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
> Graham
>
> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>
> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
> from php and something like this is possible:
>
> - block A of some php code
> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>
> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
> code.
> This would work?
It "MAY" work but as I (and others have said) it is fraught with
potential problems. It really is far better to avoid such calls
completely.
My first posted reply to this question said:
"I'm not sure what you mean by: "to be javascript edited at client
machine", but in general you are describing a pretty standard
approach, until you reach the part that says: "passing it to a Windows
cmd file (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning
data to php1"
It is more normal to perform one's processing in the programming
language of the file that receives the form data. Running "dozens of
[Windoze] programs", sounds like it could be a time consuming task,
fraught with the possibilities that one of them has an error that you
somehow have to handle and return to the user. It is occasionally
necessary to execute a shell program, but most people try to avoid
it."
and no matter how many times you ask that same question, the answer
will not change!
|
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169943 is a reply to message #169921] |
Thu, 30 September 2010 19:30 |
Jerry Stuckle
Messages: 2598
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
On 9/30/2010 5:32 AM, Captain Paralytic wrote:
> On 29 Sep, 16:42, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <paul_laut...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>
>>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> > On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >> Hello,
>>
>>>> >> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >> document, so ..
>>
>>>> >> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >> client machine) then submits
>>>> >> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >> php1
>>>> >> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>
>>>> >> So is my concept:
>>>> >> - feasible?
>>>> >> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>
>>>> >> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >> Graham
>>
>>>> > It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>
>>>> ---
>>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> to go:-(.
>>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>
>>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>>
>>>> Student Number
>>>> First Name
>>>> Surname
>>>> Faculty
>>>> Major
>>
>>>> So ..
>>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> goto 1.
>>
>>>> Is this a practical web application?
>>
>>>> Thanks again
>>>> Graham
>>
>>> So you are suggesting:
>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>
>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>> this is a practical web application.
>>
>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>>
>> ---
>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>>
>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>> (or user logs off).
>>
>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>> project.
>>
>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
>
> I too am a CICS programmer and my statement still stands. This is how
> pretty much all CRUD applications work.
Ah, old memories. I never was a CICS application programmer, but I did
do 5 years in CICS Level 2 support while I worked at IBM. Quite
stressful at the time, but looking back it was one of the better jobs I
had. :)
--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex(at)attglobal(dot)net
==================
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169945 is a reply to message #169943] |
Thu, 30 September 2010 20:54 |
Captain Paralytic
Messages: 204
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
On Sep 30, 8:30 pm, Jerry Stuckle <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
> On 9/30/2010 5:32 AM, Captain Paralytic wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>> On 29 Sep, 16:42, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>
>>> <paul_laut...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> > On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>
>>>> > <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> >> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >>> Hello,
>
>>>> >>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >>> document, so ..
>
>>>> >>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >>> client machine) then submits
>>>> >>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >>> php1
>>>> >>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >>> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >>> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>
>>>> >>> So is my concept:
>>>> >>> - feasible?
>>>> >>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>
>>>> >>> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >>> Graham
>
>>>> >> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>
>>>> > ---
>>>> > Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> > to go:-(.
>>>> > not very practical - Jerry
>>>> > it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> > not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>
>>>> > But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> > suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> > fields (Forms?) for:
>
>>>> > Student Number
>>>> > First Name
>>>> > Surname
>>>> > Faculty
>>>> > Major
>
>>>> > So ..
>>>> > 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> > Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> > Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> > goto 1.
>
>>>> > Is this a practical web application?
>
>>>> > Thanks again
>>>> > Graham
>
>>>> So you are suggesting:
>>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>
>>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>>> this is a practical web application.
>
>>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>
>>> ---
>>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>
>>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>>> (or user logs off).
>
>>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>>> project.
>
>>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
>
>> I too am a CICS programmer and my statement still stands. This is how
>> pretty much all CRUD applications work.
>
> Ah, old memories. I never was a CICS application programmer, but I did
> do 5 years in CICS Level 2 support while I worked at IBM. Quite
> stressful at the time, but looking back it was one of the better jobs I
> had. :)
>
I still love programming under CICS when I get the chance.
|
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169946 is a reply to message #169935] |
Fri, 01 October 2010 04:12 |
Graham Hobbs
Messages: 42
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
|
Member |
|
|
On Thu, 30 Sep 2010 11:52:27 -0400, Graham Hobbs <ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
wrote:
> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs <ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> >On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> >> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >> document, so ..
>>>>
>>>> >> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >> client machine) then submits
>>>> >> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >> php1
>>>> >> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>>
>>>> >> So is my concept:
>>>> >> - feasible?
>>>> >> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>>
>>>> >> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >> Graham
>>>>
>>>> >It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>>
>>>> ---
>>>> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> to go:-(.
>>>> not very practical - Jerry
>>>> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>>
>>>> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> fields (Forms?) for:
>>>>
>>>> Student Number
>>>> First Name
>>>> Surname
>>>> Faculty
>>>> Major
>>>>
>>>> So ..
>>>> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> goto 1.
>>>>
>>>> Is this a practical web application?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks again
>>>> Graham
>>>
>>> So you are suggesting:
>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>>
>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>> this is a practical web application.
>>>
>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>> ---
>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>>
>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>> (or user logs off).
>>
>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>> project.
>>
>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
> ---
> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
> Graham
>
> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>
> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
> from php and something like this is possible:
>
> - block A of some php code
> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>
> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
> code.
> This would work?
---
Folks, I am told it's a bad idea (often:().
Calling other pgms takes too much time before a response gets sent to
the user - is that one of the reasons? What might other reasons be?
Jerry you say there are differences with CICS - in brief form can you
tell me what?
I really appreciate all that's being said here - my thanks.
Jerry, CP - since you're CICS'ies any chance I could contact you
offline - am preparing a little bit of psuedocode that I hope
illustrates what am trying to do - assuming you have time to look it
over?
|
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169947 is a reply to message #169936] |
Fri, 01 October 2010 04:15 |
Graham Hobbs
Messages: 42
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
|
Member |
|
|
On Thu, 30 Sep 2010 11:56:05 -0400, sheldonlg <sheldonlg> wrote:
> On 9/30/2010 11:52 AM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs<ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>>> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> > On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> >> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >>> Hello,
>>>> >
>>>> >>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >>> document, so ..
>>>> >
>>>> >>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >>> client machine) then submits
>>>> >>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >>> php1
>>>> >>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >>> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >>> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>> >
>>>> >>> So is my concept:
>>>> >>> - feasible?
>>>> >>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>> >
>>>> >>> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >>> Graham
>>>> >
>>>> >> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>> >
>>>> > ---
>>>> > Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> > to go:-(.
>>>> > not very practical - Jerry
>>>> > it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> > not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>> >
>>>> > But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> > suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> > fields (Forms?) for:
>>>> >
>>>> > Student Number
>>>> > First Name
>>>> > Surname
>>>> > Faculty
>>>> > Major
>>>> >
>>>> > So ..
>>>> > 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> > Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> > Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> > goto 1.
>>>> >
>>>> > Is this a practical web application?
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks again
>>>> > Graham
>>>>
>>>> So you are suggesting:
>>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>>>
>>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>>> this is a practical web application.
>>>>
>>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>>> ---
>>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>>>
>>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>>> (or user logs off).
>>>
>>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>>> project.
>>>
>>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
>> ---
>> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
>> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
>> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
>> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
>> Graham
>>
>> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
>> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>>
>> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
>> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
>> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
>> from php and something like this is possible:
>>
>> - block A of some php code
>> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
>> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>>
>> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
>> code.
>> This would work?
>
> exec or system. Those work on Unix. I have never used php of windows
> servers, but I imagine they would work the same way.
>
> Like I said, though, "not a good idea".
---
Why?
not being flippant, couldn't think of a longer winded response:-)
|
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169950 is a reply to message #169946] |
Fri, 01 October 2010 09:35 |
Captain Paralytic
Messages: 204
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
|
On 1 Oct, 05:12, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Sep 2010 11:52:27 -0400, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net>
>> wrote:
>
>>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>>> <paul_laut...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> > On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>
>>>> > <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> > >On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> > >> Hello,
>
>>>> > >> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> > >> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> > >> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> > >> document, so ..
>
>>>> > >> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> > >> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> > >> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> > >> client machine) then submits
>>>> > >> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> > >> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> > >> php1
>>>> > >> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> > >> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> > >> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> > >> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>
>>>> > >> So is my concept:
>>>> > >> - feasible?
>>>> > >> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>
>>>> > >> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> > >> Graham
>
>>>> > >It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>
>>>> > ---
>>>> > Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> > to go:-(.
>>>> > not very practical - Jerry
>>>> > it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> > not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>
>>>> > But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> > suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> > fields (Forms?) for:
>
>>>> > Student Number
>>>> > First Name
>>>> > Surname
>>>> > Faculty
>>>> > Major
>
>>>> > So ..
>>>> > 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> > Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> > Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> > goto 1.
>
>>>> > Is this a practical web application?
>
>>>> > Thanks again
>>>> > Graham
>
>>>> So you are suggesting:
>>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>
>>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>>> this is a practical web application.
>
>>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>>> ---
>>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>
>>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>>> (or user logs off).
>
>>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>>> project.
>
>>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
>> ---
>> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
>> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
>> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
>> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
>> Graham
>
>> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
>> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>
>> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
>> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
>> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
>> from php and something like this is possible:
>
>> - block A of some php code
>> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
>> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>
>> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
>> code.
>> This would work?
>
> ---
> Folks, I am told it's a bad idea (often:().
>
> Calling other pgms takes too much time before a response gets sent to
> the user - is that one of the reasons? What might other reasons be?
>
> Jerry you say there are differences with CICS - in brief form can you
> tell me what?
>
> I really appreciate all that's being said here - my thanks.
>
> Jerry, CP - since you're CICS'ies any chance I could contact you
> offline - am preparing a little bit of psuedocode that I hope
> illustrates what am trying to do - assuming you have time to look it
> over?
I would post the pseudo code here where more people can look it over.
Also an explanation of WHY it is so important that the processing be
handled via a Windoze cmd file and what this processing is would be
useful.
As it is we are all left to our own imaginations as to why anyone
would design something like this.
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169953 is a reply to message #169946] |
Fri, 01 October 2010 11:43 |
Jerry Stuckle
Messages: 2598
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
|
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On 10/1/2010 12:12 AM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Sep 2010 11:52:27 -0400, Graham Hobbs<ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs<ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>>> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> > On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> >> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >>> Hello,
>>>> >
>>>> >>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >>> document, so ..
>>>> >
>>>> >>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >>> client machine) then submits
>>>> >>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >>> php1
>>>> >>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >>> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >>> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>> >
>>>> >>> So is my concept:
>>>> >>> - feasible?
>>>> >>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>> >
>>>> >>> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >>> Graham
>>>> >
>>>> >> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>> >
>>>> > ---
>>>> > Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> > to go:-(.
>>>> > not very practical - Jerry
>>>> > it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> > not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>> >
>>>> > But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> > suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> > fields (Forms?) for:
>>>> >
>>>> > Student Number
>>>> > First Name
>>>> > Surname
>>>> > Faculty
>>>> > Major
>>>> >
>>>> > So ..
>>>> > 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> > Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> > Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> > goto 1.
>>>> >
>>>> > Is this a practical web application?
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks again
>>>> > Graham
>>>>
>>>> So you are suggesting:
>>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>>>
>>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>>> this is a practical web application.
>>>>
>>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>>> ---
>>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>>>
>>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>>> (or user logs off).
>>>
>>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>>> project.
>>>
>>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
>> ---
>> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
>> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
>> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
>> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
>> Graham
>>
>> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
>> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>>
>> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
>> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
>> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
>> from php and something like this is possible:
>>
>> - block A of some php code
>> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
>> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>>
>> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
>> code.
>> This would work?
> ---
> Folks, I am told it's a bad idea (often:().
>
> Calling other pgms takes too much time before a response gets sent to
> the user - is that one of the reasons? What might other reasons be?
>
That's one of them - but also, it rapidly gets to be a nightmare,
passing data back and forth, interactions between scripts, error
handling and all kinds of things.
> Jerry you say there are differences with CICS - in brief form can you
> tell me what?
>
Mainly how you handle links and pass data between transactions
(scripts). However, you have to be more careful with web apps because
you can never trust data coming from the user in web apps - there is no
way to keep the user from changing the html, potentially sending
anything he/she wants.
> I really appreciate all that's being said here - my thanks.
>
> Jerry, CP - since you're CICS'ies any chance I could contact you
> offline - am preparing a little bit of psuedocode that I hope
> illustrates what am trying to do - assuming you have time to look it
> over?
No. I help in the newsgroups as time permits. Offline assistance is at
my normal consulting rates. Sorry - but it got to be too time consuming
and I was losing billable hours.
--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex(at)attglobal(dot)net
==================
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169954 is a reply to message #169947] |
Fri, 01 October 2010 13:18 |
sheldonlg
Messages: 166
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 10/1/2010 12:15 AM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Sep 2010 11:56:05 -0400, sheldonlg<sheldonlg> wrote:
>
>> On 9/30/2010 11:52 AM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs<ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>>>> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs<gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> >> On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> >>> On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> >>>> Hello,
>>>> >>
>>>> >>>> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> >>>> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> >>>> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> >>>> document, so ..
>>>> >>
>>>> >>>> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> >>>> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> >>>> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> >>>> client machine) then submits
>>>> >>>> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> >>>> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> >>>> php1
>>>> >>>> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> >>>> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> >>>> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> >>>> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>>> So is my concept:
>>>> >>>> - feasible?
>>>> >>>> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>> >>
>>>> >>>> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> >>>> Graham
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ---
>>>> >> Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> >> to go:-(.
>>>> >> not very practical - Jerry
>>>> >> it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> >> not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>> >>
>>>> >> But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> >> suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> >> fields (Forms?) for:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Student Number
>>>> >> First Name
>>>> >> Surname
>>>> >> Faculty
>>>> >> Major
>>>> >>
>>>> >> So ..
>>>> >> 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> >> Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> >> Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> >> goto 1.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Is this a practical web application?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Thanks again
>>>> >> Graham
>>>> >
>>>> > So you are suggesting:
>>>> > 1) User submits a request.
>>>> > 2) Server supplies a response.
>>>> >
>>>> > This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>>> > this is a practical web application.
>>>> >
>>>> > I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>>>> ---
>>>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>>>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>>>>
>>>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>>>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>>>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>>>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>>>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>>>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>>>> (or user logs off).
>>>>
>>>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>>>> project.
>>>>
>>>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>>>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>>>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
>>> ---
>>> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
>>> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
>>> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
>>> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
>>> Graham
>>>
>>> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
>>> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>>>
>>> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
>>> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
>>> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
>>> from php and something like this is possible:
>>>
>>> - block A of some php code
>>> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
>>> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>>>
>>> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
>>> code.
>>> This would work?
>>
>> exec or system. Those work on Unix. I have never used php of windows
>> servers, but I imagine they would work the same way.
>>
>> Like I said, though, "not a good idea".
> ---
> Why?
> not being flippant, couldn't think of a longer winded response:-)
Error tracking,
synchronicity,
data passing,
dependence upon grandchild calls over which you may not have control,
interactions among multiple calls and grandchild calls,
etc.
(By grandchild calls I mean calls that your calls make and so on down
the stack).
I like to have control over every aspect of the code I write. That way
I can plan for (hopefully) all contingencies. Just try debugging
something over which you have no control of the code and you will see
just what I mean.
--
Shelly
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| Re: Iterative interfacing between client and server [message #169956 is a reply to message #169946] |
Fri, 01 October 2010 15:08 |
Graham Hobbs
Messages: 42
Registered: September 2010
Karma: 0
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Member |
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On Fri, 01 Oct 2010 00:12:00 -0400, Graham Hobbs <ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Sep 2010 11:52:27 -0400, Graham Hobbs <ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:42:38 -0400, Graham Hobbs <ghobbs(at)cdpwise(dot)net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 29 Sep 2010 07:17:14 -0700 (PDT), Captain Paralytic
>>> <paul_lautman(at)yahoo(dot)com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 29 Sep, 04:16, Graham Hobbs <gho...@cdpwise.net> wrote:
>>>> > On Mon, 27 Sep 2010 07:39:07 -0400, Jerry Stuckle
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > <jstuck...@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> > >On 9/26/2010 10:06 PM, Graham Hobbs wrote:
>>>> > >> Hello,
>>>> >
>>>> > >> Am still new at this, need to understand a concept before I start
>>>> > >> coding. While the following is an over simplification, at the moment I
>>>> > >> am more concerned with a) 'can it be done', b) preparing a design
>>>> > >> document, so ..
>>>> >
>>>> > >> 1. my website will be driven by server pgm php1
>>>> > >> 2. client accesses the one page website
>>>> > >> 3. client enters/edits data in Forms ( to be javascript edited at
>>>> > >> client machine) then submits
>>>> > >> 4. pgm php1 receives the form data, passing it to a Windows cmd file
>>>> > >> (calling dozens of pgms) for further processing and returning data to
>>>> > >> php1
>>>> > >> 5. php1 then returns the same page to the client with mostly the same
>>>> > >> Form data but with additions and changes
>>>> > >> 6. client views the Form data
>>>> > >> 7. Repeat 3 thru 7 until client happy with results.
>>>> >
>>>> > >> So is my concept:
>>>> > >> - feasible?
>>>> > >> - reflects the way it's normally done (i.e. practical)?
>>>> >
>>>> > >> Please, thanks in advance
>>>> > >> Graham
>>>> >
>>>> > >It can be done. I don't think it's very practical, though.
>>>> >
>>>> > ---
>>>> > Thanks for your answers. So it can be done but my way is not the way
>>>> > to go:-(.
>>>> > not very practical - Jerry
>>>> > it is a bad idea - Shelly
>>>> > not that this makes this idea any better - Capt Para
>>>> >
>>>> > But am not a lot clearer on the 'best way'. Simplifying I hope,
>>>> > suppose a user accesses my one page website, s/he sees unpopulated
>>>> > fields (Forms?) for:
>>>> >
>>>> > Student Number
>>>> > First Name
>>>> > Surname
>>>> > Faculty
>>>> > Major
>>>> >
>>>> > So ..
>>>> > 1. The user enters Student Number, clicks Submit
>>>> > Server uses Student Number to access an sql table
>>>> > Server sends page with first name, surname, faculty, major populated
>>>> > goto 1.
>>>> >
>>>> > Is this a practical web application?
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks again
>>>> > Graham
>>>>
>>>> So you are suggesting:
>>>> 1) User submits a request.
>>>> 2) Server supplies a response.
>>>>
>>>> This is what every web page in the world does and you are asking if
>>>> this is a practical web application.
>>>>
>>>> I'm sure you can work out that it is.
>>> ---
>>> Yes to your 1 and 2 and is very clear. That's half of what I asked..
>>> What I'm asking is 'can this be an iterative transaction'.
>>>
>>> When I program CICS transactions I give the user a screen, he enters a
>>> student number, a CICS pgm presents the results and sends a populated
>>> screen; user updates some fields clicks Enter, changes are made to the
>>> database, the same screen is represented with an 'update successful'
>>> msg, user makes more changes, enter, database update, represent screen
>>> etc. Then user enters anew student number and the same process occurs
>>> (or user logs off).
>>>
>>> Points are taken with respect to logon ID/password - more scope for my
>>> project.
>>>
>>> OK, maybe my original question might have been 'can I pgm in
>>> php/html/javascript to emulate such a CICS transaction'?
>>> Is this what is being suggested as impractical?
>> ---
>> CP, Jerry, Shelly,
>> CICS eh! Am starting to feel at home:-) .. likely you know too what
>> copybooks are? I will think to your comments especially about the
>> 'cics differences' and will bother you again shortly - sorry .
>> Graham
>>
>> P.S. Have googled, bought a php video tutorial, still not clear on
>> 'calls' so a side question if I may:
>>
>> Being able to call a windows cmd file from my driver php pgm is a MUST
>> for my project (enormously larger than the student record system I
>> used as illustration) .. but I believe I can call a windows cmd file
>> from php and something like this is possible:
>>
>> - block A of some php code
>> - 'call udogen.cmd aparm, bparm' (udogen contains many calls)
>> - block B of more php code e.g 'test return code'
>>
>> i.e. after udogen.cmd has run control returns to block B with a return
>> code.
>> This would work?
> ---
> Folks, I am told it's a bad idea (often:().
>
> Calling other pgms takes too much time before a response gets sent to
> the user - is that one of the reasons? What might other reasons be?
>
> Jerry you say there are differences with CICS - in brief form can you
> tell me what?
>
> I really appreciate all that's being said here - my thanks.
>
> Jerry, CP - since you're CICS'ies any chance I could contact you
> offline - am preparing a little bit of psuedocode that I hope
> illustrates what am trying to do - assuming you have time to look it
> over?
---
Msgs with reasons received with thanks and understood. Will post the
psuedocode here in a few days (need to make sure it's logically
correct).
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